I didn't think this would ever happen. For weeks now I have been wanting to address the "I told you so" phenomena. Today is the day.
First I need to make some announcements
Edwafin Insurance
Yesterday I quoted Patrick Stapleton as saying that the insurance policy they had had been allowed to lapse. A person, interested in joining the Class Action wrote me an email this morning which I partially quote below. I suspect she wants to remain anonymous, and therefore respect that:
I think we have now gathered a good number of individuals who have shown an interest in participating in a possible Class Action against the (past)Directors of Edwafin. I have communicated with my Attorney, and asked her to consider the matter - the feasibility and timing, etc., so I am awaiting her response. Somehow I have a feeling that we may have to delay taking positive action, if any, until the liquidators have finished their job. However, suggestions are welcome. This is an urgent matter for most of us but whatever happens, it is not going to happen overnight so we have to let things happen according to the professionals.
Again, if you would like to participate in any possible Class Action, please send your details to edwafinclass@chromatique.com. It is confidential and at this stage and places you under no obligation. Once matters have progressed, you may have to reconsider your participation, but you will always be kept fully appraised through various media and a private website.
WARNING: Those who have their feet firmly on mother Earth, you may want to stop reading.
Yesterday we spoke about the comments of anonymous, who instructed us to suspend our own thought processes, and to place all our confidence in the findings and decision of the liquidators, courts, police and other similar social constructs. My argument was to do so would be to deny our own experience of reality and essentially submit to the limitations and restriction imposed on us by groups of collective conciousness. (I tried to make that in one sentence, biut alas: no.) Anonymous's supposition is that the liquidators necessarily have the investors interest at heart. In a way yes - according to the description of the structure. First of all, though, they have their own interests at heart - money for them., it is their way of earning money. Thereafter we get the salaries that still need to be paid (including those of the directors I suspect), other primary and preferred creditors, court costs etc. not necessarily in that order. Then, and only after all those beuaties have been paid, it is the debenture holder's turn. About the legal issues I have my doubts as well, as they will have to make a appraisal whether any legal action instituted by them would be successful. Even if they decided to do so, and they win a case in court, it appears to me it will most probably be a criminal case. If so, and found guilty, those charged may go to jail or be fined, but that money does not go to the investors, it goes to.... I can not imagine a criminal court ordering any directors to pay damages to investors- a civil court action would be required for that.
Anonymous obviously meant well, as those are the values imprinted on us by those who want us to conform to their concept or idea of what reality should be. Imagine a sea of souls, all standing flat-feet on planet earth - they are the planet. Here and there, though, you have a few who stand on their toes because they regard it important to stand out above others. Now, keep in mind, excellence is a characteristic that needs to be admired but usually that results in souls with imposing statures. However, standing on your toes to achieve the same leads to cramps in one's legs and butt pains in others.
This phenomena is commonly "sanctimony", and is derived from the word sanctus or holy. (Of course that is a clue - didn't you get it?) As such it is also a quality or archetype most of us have to some degree, that is unless you are truly holy, and then you would probably not be around much. How does one recognize this archetype? They usually display the following qualities:
First I need to make some announcements
Edwafin Insurance
Yesterday I quoted Patrick Stapleton as saying that the insurance policy they had had been allowed to lapse. A person, interested in joining the Class Action wrote me an email this morning which I partially quote below. I suspect she wants to remain anonymous, and therefore respect that:
I can confirm that Edwafin does have PL/Fidelity cover with Coleman Gold Brokers based in Hillcrest, Durban.Class Action
It is an annual policy that falls due for renewal in July.
So from what I can see, we can definitely lay claim.
Please lets also go this route.
I think we have now gathered a good number of individuals who have shown an interest in participating in a possible Class Action against the (past)Directors of Edwafin. I have communicated with my Attorney, and asked her to consider the matter - the feasibility and timing, etc., so I am awaiting her response. Somehow I have a feeling that we may have to delay taking positive action, if any, until the liquidators have finished their job. However, suggestions are welcome. This is an urgent matter for most of us but whatever happens, it is not going to happen overnight so we have to let things happen according to the professionals.
Again, if you would like to participate in any possible Class Action, please send your details to edwafinclass@chromatique.com. It is confidential and at this stage and places you under no obligation. Once matters have progressed, you may have to reconsider your participation, but you will always be kept fully appraised through various media and a private website.
WARNING: Those who have their feet firmly on mother Earth, you may want to stop reading.
Yesterday we spoke about the comments of anonymous, who instructed us to suspend our own thought processes, and to place all our confidence in the findings and decision of the liquidators, courts, police and other similar social constructs. My argument was to do so would be to deny our own experience of reality and essentially submit to the limitations and restriction imposed on us by groups of collective conciousness. (I tried to make that in one sentence, biut alas: no.) Anonymous's supposition is that the liquidators necessarily have the investors interest at heart. In a way yes - according to the description of the structure. First of all, though, they have their own interests at heart - money for them., it is their way of earning money. Thereafter we get the salaries that still need to be paid (including those of the directors I suspect), other primary and preferred creditors, court costs etc. not necessarily in that order. Then, and only after all those beuaties have been paid, it is the debenture holder's turn. About the legal issues I have my doubts as well, as they will have to make a appraisal whether any legal action instituted by them would be successful. Even if they decided to do so, and they win a case in court, it appears to me it will most probably be a criminal case. If so, and found guilty, those charged may go to jail or be fined, but that money does not go to the investors, it goes to.... I can not imagine a criminal court ordering any directors to pay damages to investors- a civil court action would be required for that.
Anonymous obviously meant well, as those are the values imprinted on us by those who want us to conform to their concept or idea of what reality should be. Imagine a sea of souls, all standing flat-feet on planet earth - they are the planet. Here and there, though, you have a few who stand on their toes because they regard it important to stand out above others. Now, keep in mind, excellence is a characteristic that needs to be admired but usually that results in souls with imposing statures. However, standing on your toes to achieve the same leads to cramps in one's legs and butt pains in others.
This phenomena is commonly "sanctimony", and is derived from the word sanctus or holy. (Of course that is a clue - didn't you get it?) As such it is also a quality or archetype most of us have to some degree, that is unless you are truly holy, and then you would probably not be around much. How does one recognize this archetype? They usually display the following qualities:
- They utter expressions such as: "I told you so", "when will we ever learn?", "this should never haven been allowed to happen", etc.
- Frequently they utter their profound statements after some or other calamity, but not necessarily always.
- Frequently they make wildly loose and vague statements that sound profound and learned, but actually bridges two different - often contradicting - realities. Yesterday's comment was about this phenomenon.
- There is the expectation that the receiver will suspend all his own thought processes and substitute them his by those of the sanctimoner.
- The sanctimoner earnestly believes that his statement is a reflection of reality, and that all other realities should therefore be incorrect and changed.
As a classically trained musician and academic I have encountered countless sanctimoners in my current sojourn on this planet. Not so much the practical musicians - either you can play an instrument well or you can't - but amongst the academics of our culture sanctimony is rampant. I have often found it most humorous that those who have the least to offer, suffer from the greatest degree of sanctimoniousness (oops!).
Here is an example. Personally, I can't stand male operatic singers, neither most females either. Their exaggerated bleating and bellowing just does not please my sensibilities (there is/was one exception and that is the late SA Deon van der Walt, a most sensible singer). Now, the fact that I don't like these huffers and puffers of noisy wind does not make them bad musicians, and does not give me the right to pronounce them as worthless to the music world. It is just my taste. It has no further implications to creation.
Yet in academia, a sanctomonier will inflate himself by merely stating that such and such a composition is "bad", or that it was a bad performance or musician. keep in mind the points I mentioned above. This person immediately assumes control over total reality by expressing his personal taste as a universal truth. Done! I'm that important. Society has become so gullible that these folks often rise to the top in their sphere of activity.
We have encountered a few of said archetypes on our blog as well. Most irritating are the "I told you so'ers". Can you see the imagination at work here. The perpetrator may be a journalist, and since most of humankind have lost the ability to communicate telepathically, we have to do so via the phone, or in person or in newspapers. Perhaps this person did, through his limited communication medium, tell or warn some about the possible dangers of investing with Edwafin. This does not imply that the message was disseminated universally in the first place. It also does not imply that his message has universal truth. By its very nature, this kind of statement is very apt following a misfortune of some kind. Imagine that Edwafin had not folded and after five year you have received your money back with interest. How many I told you so's would you have received then as opposed the ones that are uttered now. That is called benefiting from the opportunity. Of course, they miss the point of investing completely. Investing is about making money from money often with a risk factor involved. It is not an exact science, and nobody has all the answers. It is done daily on the stock exchange, and in a variety of other methods. our debentures were merely an option that we followed. As I have stated in the past, where would the cutoff point be as far as interest rates are concerned. Currently 5% would be a lot in the UK. Again they miss the point totally, and have you noticed how little concern these folk really have about those that have lost in the process. Of course not, because it is about the ego - sanctimoniousness.
Recently, we received a very nice comment from an anonymous. It said something like "Some would describe you investors as foolish, but you did nothing wrong, you were the victims..." Something along that line. Can you spot it? This is called "borrowed" reality, or transference of sanctimony.
Then there is the other famous one: "Will we ever learn?" In the absence of a particular person to direct the question to, it is made as wide as possible: "we". Obviously, although stated as a question it is in reality a statement that is secretly combined with a shake of the head. Any bets that this person did not include himself in the "we". This soul unquestionably had a field day telling all those millions of people who lost over $24 trillion on the recent stock market crash: "Will we ever learn?"
To all the investors who have now lost money to Edwafin, at least we have provided the sanctimonious with additional status. Without us, where would they be?
Here is an example. Personally, I can't stand male operatic singers, neither most females either. Their exaggerated bleating and bellowing just does not please my sensibilities (there is/was one exception and that is the late SA Deon van der Walt, a most sensible singer). Now, the fact that I don't like these huffers and puffers of noisy wind does not make them bad musicians, and does not give me the right to pronounce them as worthless to the music world. It is just my taste. It has no further implications to creation.
Yet in academia, a sanctomonier will inflate himself by merely stating that such and such a composition is "bad", or that it was a bad performance or musician. keep in mind the points I mentioned above. This person immediately assumes control over total reality by expressing his personal taste as a universal truth. Done! I'm that important. Society has become so gullible that these folks often rise to the top in their sphere of activity.
We have encountered a few of said archetypes on our blog as well. Most irritating are the "I told you so'ers". Can you see the imagination at work here. The perpetrator may be a journalist, and since most of humankind have lost the ability to communicate telepathically, we have to do so via the phone, or in person or in newspapers. Perhaps this person did, through his limited communication medium, tell or warn some about the possible dangers of investing with Edwafin. This does not imply that the message was disseminated universally in the first place. It also does not imply that his message has universal truth. By its very nature, this kind of statement is very apt following a misfortune of some kind. Imagine that Edwafin had not folded and after five year you have received your money back with interest. How many I told you so's would you have received then as opposed the ones that are uttered now. That is called benefiting from the opportunity. Of course, they miss the point of investing completely. Investing is about making money from money often with a risk factor involved. It is not an exact science, and nobody has all the answers. It is done daily on the stock exchange, and in a variety of other methods. our debentures were merely an option that we followed. As I have stated in the past, where would the cutoff point be as far as interest rates are concerned. Currently 5% would be a lot in the UK. Again they miss the point totally, and have you noticed how little concern these folk really have about those that have lost in the process. Of course not, because it is about the ego - sanctimoniousness.
Recently, we received a very nice comment from an anonymous. It said something like "Some would describe you investors as foolish, but you did nothing wrong, you were the victims..." Something along that line. Can you spot it? This is called "borrowed" reality, or transference of sanctimony.
Then there is the other famous one: "Will we ever learn?" In the absence of a particular person to direct the question to, it is made as wide as possible: "we". Obviously, although stated as a question it is in reality a statement that is secretly combined with a shake of the head. Any bets that this person did not include himself in the "we". This soul unquestionably had a field day telling all those millions of people who lost over $24 trillion on the recent stock market crash: "Will we ever learn?"
To all the investors who have now lost money to Edwafin, at least we have provided the sanctimonious with additional status. Without us, where would they be?
10 comments:
Suggest you contact the insurance company who provided PL/Fidelity cover with Coleman Gold Brokers based in Hillcrest, Durban urgently for more info on how to recover some of ones losses before they start "Ducking & Diving" for cover - that's assumming if there is a policy still active.
I can't find Coleman Gold Brokers based in Hillcrest, Durban contact info anywhere not even on Google????
I have found a CF Coleman in Kloof (on the FSB website) who has a short term license.
Sounds like another Edwafin rouse start your own insurance brokerage/comnpany????
Hi Mario
As far as I know, Edwafin do have a Fidelity Cover Insurance. This cover is specificvally for FRAUD, THEFT and CORRUPTION only! It does does not cover a LIQUIDATION. The value is 20Million only. Hope this helps.
Well as far as I know it is Fraud to issue cheques with the knowledge that you don't have the funds in your bank account to cover the cheques, so to my mind we should be able to claim for at least the bounced cheques. I'm sure that would help lots of investors get by another month.
I have called CF Coleman, who was very helpful but not the Coleman we were looking for. He has given me the number of an Ian Coleman in Gillits whom I've tried to call but got voicemail. I shall try again later.
OK, so they have a R20M policy. If you ask me that still seems to be reckless trading. I would think the insurance value should have been equivalent to the value of the investors money. Yippi... I might get an extra 10c in the rand.
(Not that I'm ungrateful for an extra 10c per rand)
One cannot assume there has been reckless trading until this fact has been uncovered.
The policy does not cover reckless trading.
Cover against theft and fraud does not have to equal the sum invested.
It is cover for incidences of theft and fraud lodged against the directors, could be them or it could be staff according to my understanding. Nonetheless it still needs to be proven.
Me thinks proving that this was nothing more than a Ponzi scheme with Edwafin added "bells & whistles" to disguise the true intentions of the group, is easy.
It's is clear that investor monies were used to pay investors - sort of robbing Peter to pay Paul. In short a Ponzi scheme sold as attractive debentures in a flashy venture capital company. With no real world business ventures producing enough postive cash flow to cover investor funds and certainly not enough to pay back the inflated and orchestrated inter-company loan accounts.
Proving reckless trading is not the issue, however fraud & theft is...
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